4:59 video
December 9, 2015
Bikini bondage for curvy MILF Lola thanks to my pals at LeggyBondage.com!
12:21 video
December 4, 2015
On-Screen Huge Gagging, Sitting Strappado & Big Boob Tying for Sweater-ed Secretary!
Sandra sits alone in the darkness. Shes tied to a metal chair in the basement. She cant get away, but at least she's comfortable. Thats about to change. The light come on and her captor enters. The first thing to go is that kind cleave gag. It is turned into a massive wad of mouth stuffing for the tight, around-the-head vetwrap gag she now has to endure. Next her elbows. distinctly uncontaminated by rope. Takes care of that and cinches her elbows together and in one flowing move, pulls her into a bent-over seated strappado with her arms tied to the top of the chair back. her sweater is pulled down revealing her huge, vulnerable breasts. Tight, intricate rope is added to each of her massive mammaries, she moans and struggles with each wrap, but it just keeps getting tighter...
10:58 video
December 3, 2015
Buxom, Bent-Over, Toe-tied MILF Gets Gagged & Bound Orgasm From Girlfriend!
I was having a heck of a day dealing with paperwork and just wanted to lose myself in some really tight rope. I ended up stripped down to my panties (thong ;-) and placed into a super-strict modified ball-tie. Everything was SO tight! even my thumbs and big toes were tied! Then Lisa (of LisaHarlotte.com!) decided to do me a favor. Number one, she gave me a great view by having nothing on but a smile... and then she found the 8-speed Hitachi magic wand! I was completely vulnerable and as equally eager to have her torment me and wring a rollicking, and relaxing series of orgasms out of me!
8:19 video
December 2, 2015
Special guest video from www.AlsGalsInBondage.com!
"It really bugs me when an employee complains about their job behind your back and is nice to your face. I caught Ludella Hahn saying that the job was just too hard and she does not get paid enough, so I had to show her what hard really is." :)
10:58 video
November 27, 2015
Spandex Disco Pants and Super-Tight Ropes (Turned Hogtie) for Busty MILF!
She was supposed to dust the office. Easy task, right? Not when every inch of her is completely trussed with super-tight ropes. She tries her best though, shuffling around the desk, feather duster in her tied hands. Her exasperated mmmmphhs silenced by a massive wrap-around gag, she realizes she'll never get this job done well. When he returns, he sees the terrible job she's done and decides punishment is in order. he lifts her onto the desk and with another length of rope, turns her plight into a strict hogtie. She tried to get loose, but she can barely move, let alone find any of the knots...
20:58 video
November 26, 2015
4 Topless Secretaries, Tied & Taken Away in the Van! A Blond, Redhead, Brunette & Silver Hair!
A buxom, shapely silver-haired MILF or a pretty, fit blond? Maybe something in a tall, leggy, big-titted redhead, or perky, curvy brunette? One of each? Delivered? No problem."
The quivering quartet strain against the ropes. All four have had their arms restrained tight behind their backs and and their tits tightly tied. A rope tether is attached to each of them and they are dragged into the warehouse. Each struggles furiously as, one-by-one, they are placed in the cargo van and their legs are tied. Vetwrap gags. mouth stuffing. With a loud slide and bang, the doors close, sealing them in. The engine roars to life and the van pulls away. At least they'll be together for what awaits them...
12:52 video
November 20, 2015
Hopping, Over-The-Shoulder, Clothes Destruction & Hooding For Two Captive MILFs!
THis is exactly how Sandra and Jackie wanted to spend the weekend. Their shirtless, silent hulking captor drags them to the warehouse. Both girls are thoroughly tied at the ankles, knees, chest, waist, elbows and wrists. Jackie is slung over his shoulder and Sandra is made to hop in heels. Once inside, they are thrown to the cold, concrete floor and their clothes are torn off with the assistance of a utility knife. Only their pantyhose (tights) remain. He lashes their feet together to remove any hope of escape. The struggle and plead but the muffled screams fall on deaf ears. the remnants of the girls dresses are pulled tight over their heads, sealing out the light - as well as the free flow of oxygen. Tight electrical tape is wound around their hooded heads and they are left to contemplate what awaits them next...
14:16 video
November 19, 2015
Buxom MILF Endures Being Put in a Neck-breaker Hogtie - All on-Screen!
Sandra is marched into the living room. Her elbows are pinned to her sides with her arms pulled forward, bent over a bamboo rod. All she is wearing is a dark pair of pantyhose(tights) and a ballgag seated deep behind her teeth. She is knelt over the chaise and the roping begins. Her ankles are cinched and pulled up to her bound elbows. Then some strict lengths around her chest. Her knees ache with the pressure. She thinks that relief is on its way because the ballgag is removed, but that hope is dashed when the gag is quickly replaced with several cruel coils of rope around her head and between her teeth, pulling at her cheeks and wedging her head back. the strict silencer is then tethered to her elbows. Her neck strains from the pressure as drool sneaks out of her pried open mouth. A sinister cinch is wrapped about her thighs pulling her ankles up and her head back even more. She is truly helpless. And so are her pretty feet. The nylon encasing her feet are torn off exposing her vulnerable soles. A few stern swats with a leather strap (bastinado) will keep her from struggling... or maybe make her struggle more...
19:54 video
November 18, 2015
Self Bondage, Girl/Girl Bondage, Gag Kissing, Gag Talking
Darla wanted to surprise her hubby with a special anniversary gift when he gets home from a business trip that evening. So she enlists the help of her friend, Sandra, to make it really special. The both dress in vintage lingerie complete with garters, stockings and heels, then the rope comes out. ALL ON SCREEN – Dale takes rope out from the nightstand and starts to tie Sandra up. She starts with Sandra’s ankles and knees, then a crotch rope! Sandra’s hands are then tied behind her back and a beautiful chest harness is applied. Sandra then settles in and watched Darla tie herself up. Darla starts by tying her chest and adding a crotch rope to herself. Then she ties her knees and ankles. Now for the gags! Darla gets out a couple of cloths and duct tape. She wads up a cloth and puts it in Sandra’s mouth. Then Sandra’s lips are sealed with three long strips of duct tape. Now it’s Darla’s turn. She fills her mouth with a cloth and then adds layers of the sticky duct tape to her face, sealing the cloth in. Then the handcuffs… which the only key to is on her hubby’s key ring that he carries with him. A few clicks and Darla’s hands are secured behind her. Now all there is to do is to rub up against each other, gag-kiss each other’s lips and bodies and wait for him to get home. Then a tone erupts from the nightstand. It’s a text message on Darla’s phone. Who could that be? She slinks her way over to the device and is shocked at what she reads! His flight was delayed! He won’t be home until tomorrow! What will they do? They try to talk to each other to figure a way out but their gags are too effective! They struggle furiously to try to release themselves, but it’s no good. All that is left to do is settle in for the bondage-filled night and wait until tomorrow for their rescue. Thank you, Darla! XO –Sandra
6:36 video
November 13, 2015
Girdle-Bound MILFs Enjoy an Afternoon of Bondage and Foot Domination!
Darla writes on the floor. She’s a vision in vintage shapewear. Thoroughly tied and tapegagged, she’s been left by Sandra to enjoy her ropes for a while. Sandra returns, pulls a book from the shelf and begins to read. But the floor is cold on her stockinged feet, do she uses Darla as a warm mat. Darla is eager to serve and wriggles beneath her girlfriends pretty peds. Sandra casually explores all of Darla’s curves with her toes before finally making her way to Darla’s face. Once there, she rests her soles upon the captive cougar’s nose and face. Darla’s nostrils drink in the aroma. She can do nothing about this foot assault, and she doesn’t want to.
5:10 video
November 12, 2015
Two Buxom, Girdle-Bound Captives, Zip-tied and Struggling for Release!
The cruel plastic cords dig into their flesh. Ruth and Sandra don’t know why they were taken, but they know they have to escape. But each struggle brings a sting of pain and a each twitch strains their muscles as the unforgiving thin straps hold fast and strong. They cant call out because of the extra set of stockings filling their mouths, which is held between their teeth by another zip tie. Heavy bosoms heave and muffled cries ring out as the damsel duo try, in vain, for some measure of comfort in their uncomfortable captivity…
51 photos
Before the site... These private photo's are from before we had decided to have a website and contain some great REAL amateur bondage. This is the first update with a video as well, shot earlier on when I was still using a GoPro.
7:02 video
November 6, 2015
Clothed Female/Nude Female MILF Bound Orgasms!
It time for payback. Darla is on the sofa completely nude. Tight ropes around her ankles and her wrists are behind her back. She is simply, but effectively, tied. A large red ballgag denies her any speech. Her head is on Sandra’s lap. She knows what is coming, she’s been waiting all day! Sandra pulls Darla close and tight and places the wand, Sandra-style (with the head in her palm and the shaft between her middle and ring fingers), on Darla’s throbbing crotch. Wait for it… wait for it… The wand springs to life!
10:04 video
November 5, 2015
MILF Strap-On Bondage Sex with Sandra & Darla
The curvy MILF is spread eagle on the bed. Tightly stretched between all four corners, She eagerly awaits the nights delights. Those delights take the form of Darla. The busty cougar, in girdle and stockings is sporting an impressive strap-on. She wants Sandra to blow her and pushes the phallus into Sandra’s eager mouth. It’s keeping her quiet, but Darla wants a little more action. She replaces the dildo in Sandra’s mouth with a huge black ballgag, and takes up position on the bed behind her very vulnerable captive…
7:39 video
November 4, 2015
Here’s a fun guest video from my friends at www.HosedNHelpless.com! Kira Dee thought this would be an easy enough afternoon. A custom video for a fan that for once did not require her to be bound nor gagged, just encased seemed easy enough.Nothing is ever easy for Kira, as seems she has another fan who has been watching her that shows up as her video ends. He feels he would prefer Kira tied and silenced and adds some of his own ideas. As she struggles, Kira makes a note to self to remember to lock her door on her next shoot.
40:56 video
October 30, 2015
37 Minutes in Heaven!
5th in the Uncut Extreme Lesbian Bondage Orgasm Endurance Challenge Series!
The rules are simple. The first woman has to get her bound partner to orgasm as fast as possible, in any way she can, and keep her on orgasmic bliss for the remainder of 37 minutes. No stopping. No breaks. No cutaways. Once the clock starts, there is no turning back.
This episode: Sandra vs Pepper.
Secretary Pepper delivers some paperwork to her workmate, Sandra. It’s almost lunchtime and Pepper wants to know what Sandra would like to do for the hour. Sandra’s easily distracted by her curvy co-worker and her mind begins to wander…
Pepper is tied on Sandra’s desk. Both buxom women are ballgagged, but Sandra is definitely in charge. For the next 37 minutes, she uses all her talents to make Pepper struggle and moan and cum… with no respite. It was all just a daydream, right?
12:44 video
October 29, 2015
Sandra, Bikini Top and Daisy Dukes Damsel Tied and Vibed in the Mobile Home!
Ravishing Redneck Sandra is being held in run-down trailer in the woods. She is tightly tied, arms overhead to a pole separating the kitchen from the rest of the trailer and made to straddle the railing. Her legs, are pinned to the pole in three different spots. Just under her (daisy-duke-clad) ass, above the knees and at the ankles, just above her strappy high-heel sandals. The rope combined with the high railing keeps her at strict attention. The ropes holding her wrists far above her head are cinched at the elbows , making her quite the long, tall, curvy captive. She strains against the punishing ropes but it’s no use. How could her situation get any worse? Her captor comes in with a device. An original Hitachi magic Wand. He pushes it deep into her crotch, duct tapes it to the railing and leaves for the day. Eventually it’ll wring the fight out of her.
23:23 video
October 23, 2015
My Public Bondage Hijinx at a Huge Fetish Convention!
Two buxom broads, both of them tightly tied, but not yet gagged are making out on the sofa. That’s me and Ruth! Lisa then seals our mouths shut with microfoam tape, but that doesn’t stop the kissing! We still struggle and smooch as Lisa talks to a national radio show about what’s going on! Later, I an corseted and bound again, of course ;-) this time Lisa and Ruth take turns, and then team up to tickle the bejeezus out of me. All in public. Totally on display!
9:49 video
October 22, 2015
Three Buxom MILFs, Topless, Tight Jeans and Even Tighter Ropes!
It wasn’t bad enough that the three MILF rommmates were robbed, but did he have to take their bras as well? The trio of captive cougars struggle on the floor. Arms pinned behind their backs, and all six of their bare feet tied together. The tight jeans showing off every curve as they fight for release. They cant call out for help, because of the massive vet wrap gags keeping them quiet. They struggle and strain as huge boobs mash into the floor. This guys was good. They aren’t going anywhere for a while.
10:25 video
October 21, 2015
Lisa Harlotte of www.LisaHarlotte.com is a sexy secretary bound tightly with red rope and gagged with a handkerchief. She struggles wildly on her boss’s couch trying to escape, but instead Lisa is restrained even more with a tight hogtie. She writhes and kicks trying to loosen her bindings, flashing her gorgeous ass split with a crotch rope. Lisa is finally rewarded for her struggles, and a Hitachi is tied to her thighs. The remote is placed in her hand, and Lisa moans and mumbles her orgasms through her tight gag.
40 photos
Nylon straps...prove to be ""very effective"" my guy came to me with a box of black straps, at first I didn't understand what they were for. He then told me to put my hands behind my back and started putting the straps on me and cinching them down. All new to me, he said this is practice for the leather straps. He secured my upper body very well. Even though it wasn't rope it was still very effective. No way out at all. As usual for him, he added a crotch rope and tied it very securely to the black strap, it was up there rubbing. I started asking way too many questions apparently and I was then blindfolded and the harness ball gag was put in. Put in a tight hogtie on the ground the straps once again proved to be just as effective as the rope. And to top it all off he tied my damn toes and attached them to my head and the ace bandage, because well I was still trying to ask questions and talk. That finally shut me up! Everything cinched down tight, all I could do was struggle...
13:53 video
October 16, 2015
Secretary Sandra Severely Spanked During Her Performance Review!
Bosslady Sydney has had it with Sandra’s incomplete reports. She hates to have to fire such a lovely addition to the office, so she instead comes up with other…motivation…
Sandra is tied bent over Sydney’s desk. She cant have any of the other executives hear what’s going on, so she silences Sandra with a ball gag topped off with a vetwrap wrap gag. Sandra’s skirt pulled up and her pantyhose are pulled down. The spanking begins. We watch as Sandra’s cheeks turn different shades of red before our eyes. For more than 10 minutes the smacks continue uninterrupted. Only to be interrupted by an important business call, which leaves the humbled secretary tethered to the desk wondering if there is anything more to the company’s discipline policy…
10:07 video
October 15, 2015
Duct Taped Camp Counselors Attempt Escape Through Teamwork!
It must have been some kind of initiation. Pepper and Sandra are on the beds in their cabin wearing their tight speedo bathing suits from swim class. Each girl has been similarly and totally tied with duct tape. It is coiled around their ankles, above and below the knees, around their thighs. It pins their arms and hands behind their backs. It also holds full bandannas of mouth stuffing in their mouths. They try their best to escape, but their taped up fingers may get in the way…
7:45 video
October 14, 2015
Fresh from the fun new site FetCams.com, where you get access to archives of live performances by LOTS fetish cam models Watch as Jessica ties the colorful Mishka to the bondage bed and then chuckle as she wriggles and squirms to get away from the tickiling fingers of Jessica. When Jessica unties Mishka then it is the turn of Mishka to tickle the bare feet of Jessica!
13:53 video
October 13, 2016
Part 8 of 8 of an 8-MILF, Movie-Length, Mini-Series Event!
This Episode: MINI_SERIES FINALE! Caroline Captured, Making 8 Bound & Gagged MILFs Loaded into the Van!
Previous Episode: Crazy Captor AJ Becomes Comely Captive #7 once KO'd by Caroline! All On-Screen!
All on Screen - Caroline is pretty proud of herself. She had conned AJ into assisting in the nabbing of all the other ladies in the office. Once those six were all tightly tied up, gagged and topless, Caroline betrayed her helper and made it seven. The contact was for eight, but she is sure her buyer will be pleased with seven. Besides, Caroline will be able to retire nicely on 87.5% of the price. As Caroline is making one last check of the knots on the secured secretaries in septuplicate (look it up ;-) She hears the van pull up just on the other side of the steel overhead doors. They're right on schedule! The door flies open and silhouetted in the sunlight is the buyer, Ben, a blond broad, bearded brute in black and boots. Caroline is proud and happy to see him. But she's concerned. He's not smiling. He counts out the beautiful booty of, um, booty and realizes Caroline is one gal short. Caroline assures him that seven is a good haul and he pleasantly assures her that he isn't going to worry about it. She's so relieved when he heads back to the van to open the sliding side door. She sure dodged that one and now she'll be rewarded for her efforts. With a sweet-smelling rag over her face. Once his strong arms were around her she probably wouldn't have been able to break free anyway, but with her consciousness slipping away, it becomes a certainty. It's lights out for our enticing entrepreneur. The contract was for eight. He has no intention of leaving, with anything less. With plenty of time to tightly tie the final piece of this awesome octadic, Her blouse is torn open for a quick peek and grope. This rouses Caroline and she is awake and aware as the rag is shoved into her mouth and, just like her seven sisters, microfoam tape is wrapped around her head to seal it in. With his eight topless trophies ready for pickup, he enlists the help of his sidekick to load the lovelies into the lorry. Starting with Ruth and continuing to Sandra, AJ, Samantha, Jackie, Lisa, Caroline and finally Vivienne, each pretty prize is lifted and carried into the waiting van. Caroline came through. Unfortunately, she'll be unavailable for future contracts.
Starring: Sandra Silvers, Ruth Cassidy, Samantha Grace, Lisa Harlotte, Jackie Christianson, Vivienne Velvet, Caroline Pierce, AJ Marion
22:15 video
September 18, 2015
Extreme Gag-Extravaganza of A Half-Dozen Tied Damsels, All On –Screen!
Continued from 1627:
Caroline stands between Sandra and Ruth, the two statuesque visions of bondage beauty. She’s quite smug with herself. She and Lisa managed to get four times more product than they bargained for. As she surveys the landscape littered with bound and gagged moneybags, she is taken completely by surprise when Lisa’s long delicate fingers find that nerve in her neck and the world begin to fade away…
She awakens on the floor, Lisa’s knee firmly planted between Caroline’s shoulder blades. Her wrists are cruelly tied behind her back. A cacophony of stifled whimpers and screams fill her ears as Lisa pulls Caroline into a tight, cross-legged hogtie. With some duct tape over her mouth, Caroline now joins the chorus. Lisa’s plan worked. She was able to deceive all five ladies into delivering themselves to her so that she can now deliver all of them to the buyer, who is only a short phone call away.
The buyer is a bear of a man. Large and definitely charge. He has no time for the pompous, preening blond who can’t help but regale him of her ingenuity in attaining such a prize. She was merely a wisp, unable to resist him when he decided to take her as well. He drags her to the floor and holds her effortlessly as resists and pleads to not join the struggling sorority surrounding her. Her cries fall on deaf ears. Those same cries are soon silenced as he stuffs a rag deep in to her mouth. “Finally.” He thinks as he wraps microfoam tape around Lisa’s head. Though thoroughly quieted, he knows that these flimsy duct tape gags are going to draw attention to the warehouse before he can arrange the pickup. One-by-one, he inspects the products and replaces the silver tape minimally stifling them with mouth-filling cloths and jaw-immobilizing medical tape. He begins with Caroline. A welcome addition, she’ll fetch a good price. He then moves to AJ and Pling. Thin, fit. Good, there’s a market for that. He then moves on to his prizes, the main reason he risked this underhanded undertaking. Sandra and Ruth. The gorgeous, busty bitches that will command the highest price. These two have been bound and gagged for over an hour and they still have fight in them. Very encouraging. That kind of stamina and energy combined with such beauty will drive the bids higher and higher. He leaves them in the darkness as he leaves to fetch the van…
21 photos; 10:01 video
April 12, 2013
Roped Real Estate Agent!
Real Estate Agent Sandra would do anything to make the sale. So even after the guy she was showing the empty house to stripped her of her clothes (all the way down to her pretty, pink lingerie) and decided he wanted to flip her, instead of the house, she was still trying to negotiate with him for the house! He silences her by showing a cloth deep into her mouth and sealing it in with coil upon coil of vet-wrap. Then leaves her in the big, empty foyer to struggle as he brings the truck around. She isn't able to escape in time and when he returns, he picks her up, OTS (Over the Shoulder) and carries her out the doors and out to the waiting truck! He unceremoniously flops her into the bed and seals her in for the trip to her new home...
17:04 video
December 11, 2015
Two MILFs Captured for Double Spread Eagle, Double-Head Dildo & Dual Vibrator Girdle-Bound Orgasm Torment!
Sandra & Jackie Are stretched out wide on the steel spring mattress. Their legs are in a scissor formation with their pert, pretty pussies synced up with a long dual-head dildo. Every twitch is a combination of agony with the steel digging into their backs and legs coupled with the ecstasy of the invader inside them holding each of the girls together Struggling and ballgagged, they are making quite the noise as each other's movements bring the other to orgasm. Their captor know that what is next will make them very loud, so he tops off their huge ballgags with multiple strips of duct tape. A pair of powerful hitachi wands are placed on their eager clits, roped in place and turned on high. The girls buck wildly with wave after wave of orgasmic pleasure. It's hot in this warehouse and they are given relief in the form of a wet towel. It is first wrung out over their faces, it is welcome and unwelcome atr the same time, but when the wet towels are placed directly over their entire heads, it's new level of intensity as they are robbed of their sight...as well as most of their air!
20:58 video
November 26, 2015
4 Topless Secretaries, Tied & Taken Away in the Van! A Blond, Redhead, Brunette & Silver Hair!
A buxom, shapely silver-haired MILF or a pretty, fit blond? Maybe something in a tall, leggy, big-titted redhead, or perky, curvy brunette? One of each? Delivered? No problem."
The quivering quartet strain against the ropes. All four have had their arms restrained tight behind their backs and and their tits tightly tied. A rope tether is attached to each of them and they are dragged into the warehouse. Each struggles furiously as, one-by-one, they are placed in the cargo van and their legs are tied. Vetwrap gags. mouth stuffing. With a loud slide and bang, the doors close, sealing them in. The engine roars to life and the van pulls away. At least they'll be together for what awaits them...
14:55 video
February 11, 2016
2 Tied MILF Secretaries Undergo Undergo Extreme Gagging and Bondage Orgasms!
Fayth and Sandra are the top two candidates from the secretarial pool to fill the executive assistant position. The job requires an ability to deal with times of prolonged stress in situations that are beyond the candidates control. The final stage of the interview process finds the comely co-workers tightly bound together to two poles in the warehouse. The supervisor enters with two rags and several rolls of vetwrap. He stuffs each girl's mouth with one of the rags and seals it in with coils of vet wrap around their heads. The candidates fearfully wonder what's to come next. They dont have to wait long. He returns with a pair of hitachi wands, the powerful old-school type. He hikes their skirts and ties each of the devices over the gals pantyhosed pussies. He wastes no time getting the girls to high speed and screaming orgasm. The girls buck and writhe but cant shake the devices loose. They are rewarded by having their silk blouses torn exposing their lacy brassieres. With more rolls of vetwrap left, he decides to completely encase each of the gals heads before he exits, leaving them in sensory-deprived orgasmic agony. He'll come back in a while to see if either girl is still enduring...
18:57 video
January 7, 2016
Two Kept MILF Slaves Brought to Bound Orgasm By Amazon Redhead Domme Captor!
Sandra and Stephanie can't keep their lips off each other. Both of the standing Buxom MILFs have been bound to suspension rings in the warehouse. Tight ropes restrain box-tied arms and even more cinch their upper arms and breasts together. They are situated just far enough away from each other so that only their lips can reach. And they make the most of that. They're eager mouths and tongues dance as Ruth, their long-legged, redhead keeper comes in. It's time to exercise her harem. She separates the lip locked lesbians and immobilizes their mouths with stern white ballgags. A new length of rope is added around each of the girls inside ankles tethers them together as Ruth retreats to retrieve something from the workbench. What does she have in mind? She returns with a matching pair of pearl Hitachi vibrators. We have the best seat in the house to witness Ruth's expert application of the devices to her plaything's pretty pussies and wrings orgasm after orgasm out of the gals quivering quims.
10:58 video
November 27, 2015
Spandex Disco Pants and Super-Tight Ropes (Turned Hogtie) for Busty MILF!
She was supposed to dust the office. Easy task, right? Not when every inch of her is completely trussed with super-tight ropes. She tries her best though, shuffling around the desk, feather duster in her tied hands. Her exasperated mmmmphhs silenced by a massive wrap-around gag, she realizes she'll never get this job done well. When he returns, he sees the terrible job she's done and decides punishment is in order. he lifts her onto the desk and with another length of rope, turns her plight into a strict hogtie. She tried to get loose, but she can barely move, let alone find any of the knots...